Theo, I was thinking about your questions and the resulting conversation last night.

First, did you get your question completely answered? I heard technical curiosity in you inquiries, but I also thought that there was something specific you were trying get to as well - I assumed it was related to thoughts about your particular mix.

I agree with Sean that curiosity is a good thing. It's a Buffista thang. I've enjoyed thinking about bass playing (as I know it), and hearing the discussion among folks who bring not only a different perspective, but a way broader knowledge base.

I just wanted to say I get a charge out of the music nerd talk, and acknowledge that my contribution to these conversations is limited to my observations of live performances or jams as a non-musician. Please feel free to call/correct me on ill-formed or erroneous impressions. I hate the thought of bringing down the level of discourse in a forum I value.

Yes, I found it interesting and informative -- especially because we got some specific examples, particularly as to the songs I linked.

I'm still working at recognizing 'basslines' correctly, even if they're not played by basses.

I'm still working at recognizing 'basslines' correctly, even if they're not played by basses.

It's a good way to listen. When I hung out with my friend Ivor - who was a drummer in several different bands - I'd always get him to talk about the drumming in any song we were listening to. Because that's mostly what he's listening to when he listens to music. It just made me appreciate the subtleties that a good musician can bring to the music. Pete Thomas of Elvis Costello's Attractions, for instance, does an amazing job of playing the drums to Elvis' lyrics. He really serves the song. (cf. "Green Shirt")

If you listen to Keith Moon on "I Can See For Miles" you can hear that he's actually playing lead drums. The band follows him.

It's also fascinating to compare regional styles. Al Jackson is the classic Memphis drummer, and he not only maintains a perfect groove, but he does that Memphis thing of playing slightly behind the beat. New Orleans rhythms usually have that slightly drunken, lurching ahead-of-the-beat style.

As DXM mentioned, Graham Maby's a stellar bassist. Check out his work with early Joe Jackson and later Marshall Crenshaw. "Got The Time" by Joe Jackson, in particular.

Song with great bassline beginning: "Mirror in the Bathroom" by the (English) Beat.

You know, I know some of those songs -- as in, I can (badly) sing the lyrics. But can't remember the musical openings to save my life. Guess that's part of "funny what details you concentrate on."

(But I've got a funny memory, which makes it infinitely easier to remember details if I've got something to go on. So if you played me a 3 second beginning excerpt of any of them, I'd have a fighting chance of pulling the title and group out of my ass.)

As DXM mentioned, Graham Maby's a stellar bassist. Check out his work with early Joe Jackson and later Marshall Crenshaw. "Got The Time" by Joe Jackson, in particular.

Ahh, which earworms me with a different song that I love: And it's such a crime / how they waste their time / they can't get nowhere /They've. All. Gone. BEAT CRAZY!!!

One way to gain a better understanding of how music is composed and arranged is to try and pick out a particular instrument and listen to just that part. Try and listen to how it differs from and adds to the rest of the composition.

If you can find a quadrophonic sound system with the four speakers well placed (or, barring that, a decent pair of stereo headphones), a great band to try and do this with is Pink Floyd, especially The Wall or Dark Side of the Moon. Not only will each instrument be coming from a different speaker, the various sound effects will play tricks with the speakers.

Most notably, there's a point in one of those two albums when you can hear a helicopter sound effect. If you're in the center of a properly set up quad sound system, the helicopter will circle you. It's quite distinct -- you can easily follow the chopper around the room.

Pink Floyd loved playing with sound.

::fondly remembers Mr. Carlson entering a deserted broadcasting studio as the Pink Floyd song with the barking dogs is playing....::

If you ever have a chance to visit the Stax Museum of American Soul Music in Memphis, you can listen to Steve Cropper break down how the Stax sound was different from the Motown sound, complete with a description of the role of bass (Stax's bass tended to be more melodic, whereas Motown had more rhythmic complexity) and drums (with the aforementioned Stax tendency to play behind the beat) and a side-by-side comparison of songs played Stax-style and Motown-style. I already knew all this stuff, but it was freakin' awesome to hear one of the geniuses of sound explain it.

What I need is a course in Music History a la the practical ones you get in Art History that go into the practical details.

Ken Burn's Jazz documentary helped me quantify some things that I'd never put together before that, plus finally got me over my jazz fright.

If you ever have a chance to visit the Stax Museum of American Soul Music in Memphis, you can listen to Steve Cropper break down how the Stax sound was different from the Motown sound, complete with a description of the role of bass (Stax's bass tended to be more melodic, whereas Motown had more rhythmic complexity) and drums (with the aforementioned Stax tendency to play behind the beat) and a side-by-side comparison of songs played Stax-style and Motown-style. I already knew all this stuff, but it was freakin' awesome to hear one of the geniuses of sound explain it.

I didn't know that stuff and I'd love to hear it explained with examples. I'll have to listen to iTunes and read your synopsis.

I haven't ever had too much trouble hearing the bass unless it's really buried in the mix or unless things are really symphonic and so integrated that it's like trying to identify different tastes out of a spaghetti sauce. I'm grateful for this because it's what allowed me to finally be able to figure out song chords once I knew basic chord formation theory on the guitar. There are few rock songs where the bass doesn't give you the key to what's going on.